Hi, George suggested I start a thread about this. Some hills on Mars appear to be hollow and may have artificial roofs. In some cases these roofs have been ripped open or folded over, in others there are signs of erosion leading to cavities and settling. I published a paper about these which shows many of them. I primarily use a scientific method called falsification, regarded as the best way to prove thins in science. Karl Popper, who explained this method, said that accumulating evidence for something is not good science because a refutation can always turn up later. Instead he recommended turning the argument around, to prove something is false can immediately give a scientific result. His way is how most of science works today. It's important to understand this because mainstream science defines this as the border between science and pseudoscience.
I then turn around the argument by not trying to prove these things are artificial, but by trying to prove they cannot be natural. It's not important then how artificial looking they are, but whether natural process could create them.
For example there is an image of a hill roof that is folded over (Figure 1), perhaps from being hit by a tidal wave or high wind. Rock cannot fold, so this should be impossible to form naturally.
There are also indications a second part of the roof flipped over on the right (Figure 2). There is a rough area on the right side of the roof which is approximately the same shape as the isolated rock outline on the right. That might imply a tidal wave, coming in from the ocean on the left then as it receded flipping the right part of the roof. There is one record of a tidal wave from NASA, a large crater in the north they think could have created a wave across the whole ocean. This would have needed an ocean impact to the west, there are a few candidates. An impact in water has a different kind of ejecta. It might then explain the large number of pits if the wave ripped off all their roofs. There are also many pits to the west of here, so one large impact might have wiped out a large number of these roofs.
Being in construction all my life I see exactly how the roof would peel that way. I also see that the building materials and technology would be completely different from what we are familiar.
It looks like a tin can lid that was peeled open. But the question really is what material would exist through the ages that’s not stone?
I think there would have been some flexible material in the roof, perhaps vegetation in place of rebar. In my paper on this I suggested a thatching roof with mud around it to be flexible with impacts. A roof has to be lighter to be easier to survive, mud roofs are used in many old Earth settlements. I'm sure this has been used here to reduce the weight of the roof. [Text removed by moderator] As long as some parts were still connected, like rebar in cement, then it would fold over like this. We see this in a hurricane, a part of a roof can fold over without breaking off. It's rare but as I said in the paper most pits lost their roof completely. If it was mud then the water from the tsunami might have softened it first with one wave, then the second wave flipped it. Or it went underwater with the surge and then the current pushing it softened the roof and flipped it over. This building is further west than most of them, so going underwater is more likely than the others. We see this in tsunamis on Earth, as the sea buried buildings underwater with a strong continuing current. Then the water receded which may have flipped the right side roof, though not as perfectly. This is the only one that folded, another of mine George is looking at seems to have lost a sheet of the roof exposing struts inside. That's like a building here loosing its roof in a hurricane.
The main point for me is this is completely impossible to occur naturally. It then falsified the natural explanation so there must be at least one artificial formation on Mars. To prove the first one is critical, as everything follows from that. There are no more maybes, it's a question of how many there are.
Here is a second HiRISE CTX image (D22_035927_2228_XN_42N141W) of the structure with a peeled back roof.
Structure with a peeled back roof
Yes, that's in the paper. The entrance appears to be jus to the left of where the roof flipped over. It indicates how big the entrances would have been, and how they would be hard to see from above. Also the right side probably had its roof flip to the left, this is more clearly seen here. The most likely process is the surge of a tsunami from the left then the right flipping the roof both ways.
Post by George J. Haas on Dec 18, 2018 9:17:47 GMT -5
Just below the Structure with Peeled Off Roof (Labeled A in figure 1) is another mound formation (labeled H in figure 1) with its roof blown off exposing an infrastructure showing its interior supports.
Figure 1 A: Structure with Peeled Off Roof H: Structure with exposed infrastructure
Here is a a crop of Complex H (Figure 2)
Figure 2 Complex H Note the exposed infrastructure
Here is a colorized image showing the exposed cells and supportive grid-work within the structure labeled H.
Yes I had that one marked, all of these hills may well be hollow. It could be argued part of the roof flipped over onto the ground as I've marked it here. I also discussed these amphitheaters in the attached paper. I call them that from the first one I found, they look a bit like seats around an old roman theater. They are probably Cobler Domes, rings of bricks to hold up the dome. In the image the roofs have been ripped off as well exposing the rings. A tsunami would account for all this, perhaps submerging the area softening the roofs, and ripping some off. It's conceivable every hill in this area is hollow, so the population would have been enormous. Look for more in the attached paper, the number of Cobler Domes is amazing.
As you can see, falsifying the natural explanations is a more concrete way to do this. A lot of the ambiguity is removed, you can have the skin of a natural hill ripped off exposing rings, interior struts, and cavities like this. NASA is mainly interested in falsified data, not subjective impressions like faces. This is because they evolved by differentiating themselves from subjective sciences like astrology and all its maybes.
This is why the flipped roof image is so important, there is just no ambiguity there. The first image shows an interior as well, but there is no proof there was a roof there.
Last Edit: Dec 18, 2018 18:37:46 GMT -5 by gregorme
These two indicate how many formations I've noted in the area, plus many more in a paper not marked on here. Roado means road Olympus and refers to road like formations I put on my Facebook page. With roads it becomes like a town complex on the edge of the blue ocean. You should see the words peeled roof in the grey one on the edge of the orange strip.
Here is the location of Complex H (Figure 1) in relationship with the box-shaped foundation that Greg has labeled B in his post above.
Figure 1 H: Complex H J: Box-shaped Foundation
Here is a close-up of the Box-shaped Foundation, labeled J in figure 1 (Figure 2).
Figure 2 Box-shaped Foundation
There are so many of these along with pits, surrounded by hills in various stages of collapse. A tsunami is a reasonable hypothesis, tearing and folding the roofs. This area would have received heat from Olympus Mons, also there are large channels from the volcano that probably brought warm water to the area. Similar channel come off Alba Patera further to the north, some unusual formations are clustered around there too.
Last Edit: Dec 20, 2018 1:04:50 GMT -5 by gregorme
Post by George J. Haas on Dec 20, 2018 9:41:22 GMT -5
Here is a comparison of the Box-like foundation (Slice of Bread) discovered on Mars with a similar ruined foundation dating to the Bronze Age that was discovered in the ancient city of Kislovodsk in southwestern Russia (Figure 1).
Figure 1 Box-like foundation comparison Left: Kislovodsk, Russia Right: Acheron, Mars
Notice the common D-shaped footprint and the linear cross bar support.
Here is a comparison of the Box-like foundation discovered on Mars with a similar ruined foundation dating to the Bronze Age that was discovered in the ancient city of Kislovodsk in southwestern Russia (Figure 1).
Figure 1 Box-like foundation comparison Left: Kislovodsk, Russia Right: Acheron, Mars
Notice the common d-shaped footprint and the linear cross bar support.
The interior supports are quite interesting, you can see them in pits and outlined when the roofs of some hills are settling. It's important not just to see some strong evidence, but to get a feel for how these things would be constructed. In some cases the roofs appear in HiRise, showing possible smooth cement or bricks. Connect these with road like formations and it is something we can colonize. Here are some more roads near these hollow hills. =68.ARCqgT6cy_BpoYB_XkNIeAsE2t_Jy7diD9aTn1OzH18x7h-SyE7H45V1xZtXT99D3xighr8y7eJ5XxAOwezkklrQNXPkWPcs7OIOqMzDmNHPRt-16wZjb6PoYMVr3HqTAONNwqbqReJA_SJPZ09Sx-Gi1UojrWutfduTs9YIFF5JpNs8mfbyCHB8s377g4e90ZQ_R2Dv5hyJvTWY29v7mT8HNLguN9SckSKenSYZ2AYFuRtC8zpjeSmlICCiJCR7gNyQCDlqUqxRsbh1d0PGm_cK4dfyBcY0V0scPPyq6s5X2twIofKmbf5jpyVLPWYka6uBZl_t-ZBSO9scXIkc5KjXgf-3K7944feGJIo5Qa-CkFaLH-EWHXVPatr_-2o1r1LLhURCEJW9vGmWADyuS9NExsIA2R2zWl09_CLsPSs68E6qDuPSrMtRWv0QqlXsOmS3PP-ZmRGzaJjaEUKSUC_nAOdtTPUGjedFnA4AhdIzW61CWEoc7OhE&__tn__=C-R
Post by George J. Haas on Dec 23, 2018 13:14:01 GMT -5
Moving towards the eastern side of the Box-like foundation (Labeled J in figure 1), I direct your attention to the set of mounds with exposed grid work and cellular infrastructure that I call Complex K, labeled K in figure 1.
Figure 1 J: Box-like foundation K: Group of structures with exposed infrastructure.
Here is a close-up of some of the exposed grid work and cellular infrastructure (Figure 2).